Is God real?

[Gustave]

I think that the reason the Catholic Church is having so many sex scandals is because of it's history. Priests didn't used to have to maintain celibacy, now they do. Most people, excluding our castrated friends, cannot handle this without extreme willpower. However, i think that such willpower would me misused, as i loathe all changes in church after time of Christ.

[D-Guy]

ya that rule is just lame. A man needs some lovin every once and a while(just not with alter boys).

[Dragoon Tony]

The celibacy part has do with the priest showing his devoution only to God, and proving that he has the self-control, willpower, and is willing to make huge sacrifices in order to be in the service of the church and the Lord.

I don't think the celibacy is as big a part of the sex scandals as people think. The priesthood contains a lot of mentally or emotionally "irregular" mean, and they use the priest as an "escape into the cloth". They don't want to face realty, and they hope by becoming priest their life will have more meaning. Then you get those priests who keep commiting sex offenses because they know they can get away with it because the church will protect them. If celibacy was as major as everyone thinks, then why wouldn' these MALE priests be molesting little girls, or raping women? They are petifiles, and the Catholic church protects these sickos.

I guess this is another reason why I'm so pessimistic when it comes to the Church.

[D-Guy]

Another thing, I don't seem to believe in god much but when I am in trouble I always seem to pray that I get out of it scott free. Its about a 50/50 shot.

[Gustave]

Good point, Tony. That makes sense. I still think that the situation would be slightly alleviated if priests were allowed a family.

[Dragoon Tony]

Gustave said:

Good point, Tony. That makes sense. I still think that the situation would be slightly alleviated if priests were allowed a family.

Yes, I agree, a FAMILY is the key word. I don't think priest should go out and shag random whores, that would be against the principles of priesthood. Maybe is they were allowed to start families like Reverends or Ministers, they would be able to be part of a stable unit of people.

[Sokar468]

I don't have any beliefs in relgion, because I have never seen a strong reason to do so. I have been fine without some form of God, and unless some compelling vision falls upon me, I will probably never believe in God.

I think that religion and morality are often combined. This is unfortunate, because some people believe that religion brings about morality. The truth is that people can be moral, but not religious. Just because you follow a religion doesn't mean you're gonna be a great person.

Also, I think the idea of marriage needs some work. People of religion often condemn a couple who has a child prior to marriage. I think this is nonsense. Marriage isn't going to magically turn people into good parents. Parenting is a skill that comes fom within a person, not from a church sacrament.

Another problem--priests have to give marriage counseling to Catholic couples before they get married. I'm sorry for my vulgarity, but what the f**k do priests know about marriage? Seriously, get real.

I'm not anti-religious, but I find that Religion has and causes more problems than it's worth. Just take a look at this thread and a lot of the confusion that it has caused. This is why I personally believe that relgiion should be avoided.

[Gustave]

Basically, that's my point, except from an agnostic view. I personally get moral support by reminding myself that I have to do things the Christian way. TO some of you, his may sound cheesy, but it works, and that's all that matters. I agree with you Sokar, about the whole "don't condemn people who have a kid before they're married". I think that they should have waited, but I'm not gonna shun them for it.

[Sokar468]

I think religion is great for people who truly know its meanings and do not follow it blindly. I respect people who criticize their own religion--it doesn't mean they are blasphemous, it means that they care and they want concerns about their religion addressed.

I do not like people who:
- are fanatic about a religion.
- impose beliefs on others.
- consider themselves better because of their religion.
- assume that religion will make them good.

Gustav, I respect you because you seem to have a good grip on how religion should be followed. You know what a true believer is, and not just someone who claims he's such-and-such but doesn't actually know or do anything about it.

[Gustave]

I hate people like that. It's so hard to talk with them, as they feel a need to convert you. Since i'm Catholic, my church is full of them. I love talking to episcapalians because they are supposed to question their religion.

[Dragoon Tony]

Gustave said:

I hate people like that. It's so hard to talk with them, as they feel a need to convert you. Since i'm Catholic, my church is full of them. I love talking to episcapalians because they are supposed to question their religion.

My grandmother is a very devout and pious Christian, and if I ever mentioned any of things I said on this thread to her, she would get angry. I guess as our generation grows, we'll learn to depend less on religion and look to ourselves for answers. Older generations depended on religion because at the time it provided a stable unit that they could draw support from during tough times. But nowadays religion doesn't provide any of that.

[Gustave]

yeah. Damn rapist-priests kind of messed that up

[Sokar468]

Dragonmaster said:

My grandmother is a very devout and pious Christian, and if I ever mentioned any of things I said on this thread to her, she would get angry. I guess as our generation grows, we'll learn to depend less on religion and look to ourselves for answers. Older generations depended on religion because at the time it provided a stable unit that they could draw support from during tough times. But nowadays religion doesn't provide any of that.

I think the lack of interest in modern Religion is due to the American society we live in. No longer do we have to fear going to Hell for doing bad--it's much harder to get away with crime in the modern world. No longer do we need God to help us achieve--a free market allows us to make decisions on how we advance in society. No longer do we need God to tell us how to be good--mass media has made good events known worldwide.

I'm sure there's hundreds of other reasons.

[Satoshi]

I'm a mormon... well not a model mormon, but who is model of their religion these days? Since I was a little kid, I used to believe in such and such. Now... I kinda out of touch with that. I mean, I'm kind of questioning this and that. Nowadays, I see priests rape people, abusing their power. Well... I don't know what's going on in my church, I don't even go there anymore. I guess religion is used to give people an understanding of the afterlife. But I hate people who are like total fanatics about it. I also hate hypocrites who practice what they don't preach. Okay, I guess this is enough of my ranting for one day.

[Dragoon Tony]

Sokar468 said:

I think the lack of interest in modern Religion is due to the American society we live in. No longer do we have to fear going to Hell for doing bad--it's much harder to get away with crime in the modern world. No longer do we need God to help us achieve--a free market allows us to make decisions on how we advance in society. No longer do we need God to tell us how to be good--mass media has made good events known worldwide.

I'm sure there's hundreds of other reasons.

I was thinking more along the lines of how older generations needed a religion to believe in, because it gave them strength and hope. Examples like after the Great Depression, or during the Cold War where people were so afraid they were going to die from nuclear war, etc.